Local Cop To Federal Agent – Jeff Fields

this is things police see firstand accounts with your host Stevegold welcome to the podcast that interviews active and retired police officers about their most intensebizarre and sometimes humorous moments on the job it is I old Ginger face I’mhere here again guys unfortunately I’m still hosting the show so you have to look at me or hear me thank you so muchfor being here uh really really appreciate it the patreon is growing which is which is fantastic I decided toput a little bit more work into it and now um patreon members get um the episodes early the videos early they’read free and you also get two bonus episodes a month of cops in the news umand it’s it’s a good time it’s it’s cops in the news is super fun and I knew I just kind of thought to myself why do II subscribe to a couple podcasts and did I subscribe to them and it was the bonus content I was like I want to hear moreor I want more you know more entertainment during the month and that’s why I joined so I figured I gotto do that so um yeah I Got alltime High um on patreon for people there’s there’sa bunch of different levels you can pick you will get a uh things pleas see V 3×3 vinylsticker that you can display proudly wherever I put one on my car like a year and a half ago and didn’t fade at all sohigh quality ladies and gentlemen nothing but the best for you guys um so that’s it that’s what uh that’s what’sgoing on with patreon I hate to do an ad up front but I just want to get that info out to you guys click the uh linkis in the show notes um today’s guest I’m super excited to have him he’s uhstarted started as a copper New Mexico and Arizona uh for 10 years respectivelyhe then went to the Department of Homeland Security where he did 10 years and then ended his career as a PostalInspector um along the way on his journey like many Law Enforcement Officers he uh accumulated someundiagnosed trauma some demons uh as as it may be described and he has uh youknow kind of uh figured out how to how to overcome that and defeat that so thatwill definitely be part of the discussion he’s got a great book out called sober from sin available on Amazon that will be Link in the shownotes for that so without further Ado let me bring on the great Jeff Fieldssir hey Steve thanks for having me my pleasure brother great I’m glad to seeyou were uh a fellow believer and your faith had a some uh impact on yourrecovery absolutely absolutely I uh my my family uh my wife brought me back tomy faith so I think all things come good from it so I have no aspirations ofgoing back to where I was that’s beautiful man yeah I I I listen a different podcast all time and I wasjust listening to one that wasn’t a Christian podcast or anything but um they were going over old old philosophers and old um uh quotes aboutabout faith and they were basically saying like even like you know a thousand years ago they were looking andgoing it seems like when someone gets into their late 20s and 30s if they don’t have faith they be it becomesrudderless like they there’s a panic there’s a midlife crisis there’s something that comes up if they don’thave objective truth in their life cuz it it you have no no no Compass like youjust you know the time is overs are over and now here you are how am I even supposedto be man what is my role like what are my duties how do you be a good person so this um the idea of of having a solidworldview like Christianity is is is is ancient is old you know it’s it’s it itreally can um the scales can fall off your eyes and you can see the world howit is and you can see the truth so uh I know not all my listeners are are Christian or religious but uh I i’ liketo mention that because uh it’s it’s been true for me obviously it’s been true for you and highly recommend highlyrecommend um Jeff you started as acopper like you were one of the boys man what happened you went Federal what I know I mean was it New York was it NewMexico and Arizona because it’s probably pretty hairy there yeah and and you know what in retrospect I wish I would havestayed back in the uniform um you know part of my story was the fact that I Ifound uh LW in purpose and I think when I was in the uniform I did um satisfy alot of those needs that I had um because you know when you go Federal you know you’re primarily behind the desk um youknow you do some cool stuff but it it’s more um bureaucratic and and um corporate which didn’t work for me butyeah no I come from a law enforcement family my dad um was a Texas High patrolman and then he uh became a USboard patrolman that’s what why I was in New Mexico in Arizona okay um he did that for 27 years um andyou know I’ve got a cousin in the ATF my wife is in a three-letter agency uh myin-laws were all former Federal and local law enforcement so I’m surroundedby law enforcement even though I’m out now um you know it’s been a big part ofmy life um but again I miss I miss the uniform days um and I wish I would havestuck with it but you know what it’s part of a story now yeah yeah hey that was path so uh that’s great and Itotally I totally understand what you’re saying too about when you’re in uniform you’re very much like you’re wearing the you’re waving the flag of lawenforcement you know it’s like you have the and you have the little interactions with people you get to help people youknow you you get to help on a little level like a little little cut see things pop up you give stickers out orlike you know you help a lady uh with her kid or a choking child or you know whatever it may be those littlevictories you get I imagine you’re not really exposed to that at all when you’re in suit and tie totallyunidentifiable as law enforcement no and one of the things that Drew me in to lawenforcement aside from my father um was I wanted to be the guy out in the storm I wanted to be and literally the stormlike at night I wanted to be the guy out there um when everybody else was insidehunkering down I wanted to be um the the hero I know it sounds cliche right soyou know when I started my career I was 22 years old so you know I was I was full of it ready to go get into and getinto everything I possibly could and looking matter of fact my first agency was and they don’t do this a lot anymoreif if at all my first agency was a DPS um so we were cross trained asfirefighters um which is Looney thinking about it today uh looking back becauseum it was great I got both training and you know and police and fire but if wehad a structure fire um you know half the shift would race to the fire youknow take all our gear off bunker up and go fight the fire um well looking backI’m like okay well how come nobody robbed a bank during that time because that would have been a great time to do it but also our uniforms were allpolyester and I still had my I still had those pants on underneath they would have melted to me like you know likeplastic and so yeah but it was fun I I’m glad I had that opportunity but um Ireally really got to be in the front line when I did when I took that position so damn yeah that’s crazy Imean I know they still that do that in places like Alaska because it’s kind of needed and also Texas I think has someum Public Safety like cop/ firefighter uh things but that it that is wild to think about to do to do both those jobsit’s I mean how how would they do that would they would it be the low men on the ship that would have to go or did people actually want to go they wantedto go um and so this is early 2000s I started my career on 2001 um so everybody was just excited tobe a part of some type of action um so it’s a smaller Department I think we had you know 100 officers um and so withinthose your shift typically was you know five or six you know everybody had to goand we’d call the county or the State Police in to do coverage for us while we were fighting thefire that’s wild man I know it’s Looney thinking about it I mean it I don’t knowwhy anybody nobody’s made a movie about it because it really is like action-packed it itwas you know and I don’t have any regrets about it but man again thinking back I’m like a we didn’t have the bestfire training you know we weren’t training every day a firefighter yeah just enough I mean I I can tell you thatI probably shouldn’t tell you this but we pushed fires from one end of the house through the rest of the wedestroyed houses because we did not know how to contain fire you know and I justknow we weren’t suppressing fires like we should yeah um I’m probably gonna get sued for that but the foundation Saversthat’s what we call you know yeah oh man well yeah I don’t I’m not sure that Uall these little towns around me have much better Tech than you guys probably had then but um you you hear people likethey’re like uh yeah the uh I mean these guys are they’re good A lot of them are volunteer which is like God bless themlike literally volunteer guys they train once a week and it’s like it’s unbelievable um so Jeff you’re a a youngpatrolman in you started New Mexico before Arizona correct I guess it doesn’t matter but um the your first hotcall like the first call you’re on the job you’re in uniform you get called to you’re out of training or maybe you’re still in field training and you likehave that adrenaline dump and you’re like whoa this is this is a real deal so II can only remember that the the ones that stand out the most are obviously the the calls involveed children um andso one of my first hot calls um was responding to a SIDS baby oh rightbrutal and so I I didn’t know um it was a SIDS baby at the time I um but I justremember being toned out for an unresponsive infant um you know I shootI probably was only six months out of the Academy I was done with fto um soit’s the middle of the day I’m holl and um to get there I’m the first officerthere um you know the baby sitting in a little bouncy seat in the living room with a babysitter this is in Section 8housing you know so wasn’t the best best conditions um and just you know myLayman understanding and observation I could tell that that there was just no use right there was but you know theythey train you in those situations you need to do go through the motions andyeah for the family right and so you know I I I worked on that baby man uh itmust have been probably five minutes before EMS got there and being a smaller Community you know uh the EMS truckstypically em uh is a EMT and a paramedic so um they both jump in the back of thetruck um and try to work on the actually I had it wrong I jumped in the back ofthe truck with them they wanted me to continue to do compression so I remember so my my sister was an ER nurse at thetime and I remember running into the back of that emergency room doing those little chestcompressions on that baby you know and and in your mind you’re knowing this is this is you know not going to end wellfor the family um but as a young officer and not I didn’t have a family I wassingle it seemed fake to me and I I don’t know if you can relate to this totally a lot of the children calls thatI respond I could I’m a dad now I could never absolutely do it never but um backthen and it just seemed like it was a doll it was a doll that I was just you know practicing the mannequin you knowdoing what I needed to do the two fingers over the chest yep um but umthat has stuck with me for years especially had after I had my daughter um oh yeah because I would expect thesame type of uh reaction from an officer coming to our house God forbid anything ever happened um but that wasn’t theonly time I mean I I my the first three times I I performed CPR on Duty was withchildren oh my goodness yeah that’s that’s really like that’s not commonyeah no and it and it compounded and I mean a little and you hear more a little bit more about my journey but you know Ialready had a lot on board I already had a lot of baggage you know in my life with with with other trauma and so whenI had that I didn’t think twice about it but it would be years later when it would percolate back up yeah you know II I’m dealing with the most innocent most vulnerable you know community in inthat we have children yeah so yeah man that that’s really rough um but like yousaid about it not being real the first couple like really bad uh crashes I went to it was like that like I rememberthinking this one guy rolled his car in the median I was actually on my way to work and pulled over because people were like somebody help us and um in themeeting of the highway and his car was up like leaning against a tree and thisguy’s on his knees he’s covered in stone dust cuz he’s a Mason but he like he works for a Mason and it’s he’s got likean old you know junky station wagon that he carries all his Apprentice stuff inand he was flying to work to get there in time and like he had like a cut over his um brow so the skin was like downlike I couldn’t see his eyes but I just saw blood and then his arm was like just broken and um I remember looking at himand trying to comfort him and like thankfully a a uh Duty uh firefighterthat had his kit with him pulled over like 5 minutes later but I remember looking at it and seeing him like moveand and try to talk and and it was like an animatronic Gore puppet puppet you’d see in like a horror movie you know whatI mean I was like this feels like you feel like you’re like outside the bubble almost like you’re like watching yourself you’re like this is so bizarreand it really didn’t um it it bothered I thought it was likeoh man I felt bad for him but it really that didn’t bother me as much as like the next couple I did and then it waslike um I think cuz that was like one of the first I’d seen like that that it like everyone I went to was like it’sgoing to be like that it’s going to be like crazy and what if the firefighter doesn’t show up what if someone doesn’t show up who has Advanced Medical to helpyou you’re going to have to be you know what I mean um so that gave me some anxiety but yeah it’s it’s weird itdoesn’t it’s almost you have this like veneer over you at first and then it just comes off and you’re like and Ialways tell people that that is God’s way of protecting you right yeah um fromfrom from seeing those type of traumas in your life in order for you to be able to perform what you need to do and andand you know we joke as as officers um whenever we were at Death Scenes everybody’s laughing giggling wellthat’s a you know a defense that’s a response you know right mechanism andand so I I think that and I’ve always been in faith you know I’m are coveringCatholic is what I tell people but right you know I I never put two and two together but now looking back I knowthat the fact that I was able to handle those type of calls I was uh had a good foundation of understanding um becausewe would scramble to go to those calls we wanted to go and there was guys in our shift that had kids that were likeabsolutely not yeah um you know I’m not gonna go it’s like their Nightmare and alittle tidbit I forgot to tell you um before we got on is so I was so drawn todeath investigations that I worked for an me’s office for two and a half years years really so yeah I was so in NewMexico they they have the medical examiners and it’s a part outside of thebigger metropolitan areas like Albuquerque um each County had um oncall death investigators and so I got that position the first two years asbeing a patrol officer I could do that off duty I think it was like 50 bucks for a natural death 75 bucks for an unnatural death seems low it back thenwas well back then it was nice you know um now here in North Carolina I know they pay like $200 uh a case I shouldn’tsay body I should say case um but I had a lot of traumatic experiences and andand many with children doing that position and back then it just did not sit poorly with me yeah you know which II I’m like is something wrong with me you know but no I think that’s that’s the way we were designed yeah yeahabsolutely um Jeff can you can you take us to a time when you dealt withsomething really strange or bizarre so I I really mold over this onefor a little while um because there are a lot of circumstances but um I I theone that sticks out of my mind and only because um it it Loosely um is involvedwith my problems with alcohol um and I mentioned this story in my book souh after I left uniform in New Mexico I went on with a hidea task force so I was uh doing narcotics um and so we weresouthern New Mexico were actively seeking um that at the time methamphetamine was a big deal so we itwas rare we’d have meth and fed meth and meth labs because we’re so close to the border the meth comes over from theborder but so if there was um a lab everybody was really excited about itright it’s a big deal so um I had a CI that uh told me that there was a guythat had a lab uh he was also selling a whole bunch of weed um but he had a compound and soin the area of New Mexico I grew up it’s very desolate dude I we drove through New New Mexico it is like Mars in someplaces that’s what my wife says uh she she does not like that area I I miss itI miss the desert I miss the horizons I miss being able to see the stars yeah um but yeah it’s not a great place to spenda lot of time um but yeah so this guy had a compound on you know acreage umthe closest we could get to it you know was through surveillance and he actually had the whole little Tower with a cameraon it and um all this crazy stuff to to to monitor law enforcement as well aspeople who may rip him off um so this particular uh instance you knowI applied for the search warrant I got the search warrant um but it was a big enough compound where I had to call inum another Hider group from another part of the state so those guys drove downand um you know it’s customary when another group of law enforcement comes in to help you with something you takethem out to dinner you know you go have drinks um and this is you know this ispart of the bad issues that you know we we we drank all night yeah and we had toget up at 6:00 in the morning to go to hit to Rattle a door right so cops love to drink brother I know I know and andit unfortunately it’s the culture but it may be the stress who knows right but umI know it had an effect on my performance the next day because oh yeah when we when we pulled up we’re we’rewe’re all lining up to make entry into the house um I had anAR-15 um you know I’m playing clothes so I’m wearing an outer carrier vest andcarrying a new thing called a taser um because not everybody was carrying them in that area at the time and try thisbad boy out yeah I had the taser on the front of my vest which I had never carried before um so we’re we’re stacked up infront of the house we’re ready to go uh make entry um there’s a dog barking umum I take the safety off of my AR-15 and immediately it discharges into theground um merely inches from the guy in front of his footand of course the rest of the guys think oh somebody shot the dog you know the dog’s been taken out um but at the sametime the Target that we were going after in the house comes with trailer he comes running out uh butt neck Buck neckedscreaming at us um and you know he sees the gig is up so he runs in sides and barricades himself um and ultimately youknow we make entry into the house um arrest him um and his or not coulddetain him and his wife um drag him out of the house unfortunately that turned into a FBI civil rights violationinvestigation on the team not me um there was just some I think somepeople’s temper got um the best of them yeah we were clear we were cleared fromthat I only add that uh just simply because it was one of the few times it happened to me um so anyway what wascrazy about it outside of that about the whole situation is we’re in the middle of the desert right it’s summertime umwe had gotten word from the CI that there in fact was a crocodile he had a crocodile as protection at the house wesaid no way we’re in the desert there’s just no way only a methhead would be like I not a dog what do I need Crileyeah they seem effective um sure enough he had built a little makeshift moataround that trailer and there was a little crocodile I mean it was probably two you know two foot long oh he wasstill in training wasn’t ready yeah I had a p I have a picture of it but I I couldn’t believe that you know that Iwould find I I never thought in my life I would have a crocodile on a ace on ain New Mexico on a meth lab the middle of the desert dude that’s nuts I know Iknow dude that’s so funny that you guys that come on and talk about meth labs it’s always something like that it’salways something totally totally bizarre I mean it’s got to be the meth I mean II don’t know how these guys cook up and then use and then like keep their formula tight and don’t blow themselvesup you know they don’t wear clothes I know that they don’t wear clothes they run around naked all the time yeah theresomething about meth that I’ve seen that a few times in my career like the um drug induced psychosis where they um Iguess they used to call it cocaine psychosis probably because the ‘ 80s you know and everybody would use too much coke and then all of a sudden theirclothes are off and they run down the center of town and it’s like they’re like jumping when they run and you’re like what the hell oh yeah it’s like it’s like PCP you know I don’t know whatit is or kinding to cool themselves down yeah you know but I mean this is early morning so obviously he’s sleeping onthe couch Buck necked and I guess I guess it’s nice we knew he wasn’t armed you know until he barricaded himself inthe house but right damn I guess uh I guess you guys are lucky he didn’t justopen up on you with a gun or something you know yeah yeah the wife was reaching for a gun once we got in there um uh theneighboring hia group that came to help us saw that and pulled her out of herpulled her out of the house in a way that wasn’t in our training um andthat’s what sparked rights yes yeah man you had you right on it um so I justremember that was a unique experience for me too you know have an FBI come in and do a civil rights investigation onit of course I’m like hey I’m the affiant for the warrant it was my case my CI I have nothing to do with with theDetention of people inside of the house yeah I don’t know this guy he’s from a different County he came to here to help but never seen him before in mylife but but that brings me back I forgot to so the discharge of my ARwhich you know that could have shot my partner could have got us shot because the guy it woke up the guy but it allgoes back to the fact I don’t think I was in the right mind yeah um you knowwith you know going into a house hung over I might have still been drunk who knows you know how it is oh yeah um andthat AR thank God it was pointing down to the ground you know I hadn’t lifted it up ummy my whole um story is is that it got caught on that taser that I had nevercarried before on the front of my vest yeah I mean that’s that’s what I say happened because I didn’t certainly nottouch the trigger right um you know so but it it just came back to the factthat hey if I had hit my partner or we’ve gotten gotten a shootout and theycame down to do the the shooting investigation Jeff reeks of alcohol yeahI would have been toast yeah dude you know and so that that’s just the first of many of where like what was Ithinking I know dude I I have to say like um beers with the brosis you knowis like especially when you’re younger in law enforcement beers with the guys is like the best it’s so great whenyou’re young yeah and you’re having beers with like veteran cops or evenjust guys you went through Academy with it’s like not just the beer is intoxicating but the whole situation youfeel like you’re part of this club you guys are like you know no one knows you’re struggle your coppers like you’rehanging out together it it is really this Tinder Box of like over celebration like it’s so easy to just start in aroutine of choir practice so I work midnight so I go over this guy’s house at 10:00 a.m. and we all have beers you know it’s like that’s not real normalthen you don’t get it’s that we would do that oh you see guys go to golf tournaments off midnight get hammeredand get like two hours sleep before shift and it’s like dude we can all do the math here you should not be at worklike this this doesn’t work you don’t get a two-hour nap and now you’re fine um but it is it is like um I think forme like I was I was real into uh beers with the boys uh at like the normal timeof my life but um I think it just kind of like I think having for me anyways having a very muchlike a much more like uh standard cop job than you like I I was just a patrolman and um work in my sector andand going to work and then got married had a family had kids uh noticed thatlike my I was about 30 pounds heavier than when I started and I was drinking way too many beers and slowly was ableto like just um in naturally too cuz I just didn’t feel great in the morning you know um but it was it was a longtime brother like I I remember going to my uh physical with my doctor when I was like 32 and he was a good dude retiredAlaskan state trooper so we all loved going to him and he was like how many beers you drinking and I was like youwant like an exact number he’s like yeah don’t don’t BS me how many are you drinking so I’m like I literally go and at the time I was on day shift which I’dnever been on so I was like coming home at night usually and like grilling up and drinking beers and I’m like I’m likeI don’t know U 30 a week and he’s like 30 beers I’m like yeah I’m not gettinghammered but you know Grill up have four or five Miller lights and he’s like Steve that’s way too many beers I’m likebut in the where I was at with the people I hung out with that wasn’t like well I don’t not getting hammeredbecause my tolerance was Skyhigh and I weigh 235 PBS and I’m 5 fo 10 um but Iremember him being like just so like he’s like believe me you got to slow down with that you got to stop oh yeahand and he was right man I I ended up you know getting like a a prostatitis infection where my pelvic floor swelledup and I couldn’t sit right and it was like it led to these other things at my body and and then that with like youknow the lack of sleep as a cop but it all starts with those like get togethers in the beginning when it’s just so muchfreaking fun you know yeah and I nobody ever points out and I it’s unfortunateand this is the stigma that I’d like to try to to break is that nobody talks about it like you know I knew guys thatdrank is equally as much as me and I always drink a lot I’m a beninge drinker or I was a beningedrinker but I didn’t know I had a problem until I had a an audience like I say with my wife yeah because thecommunity I was around for like a normal person to look at you 20 plus years ththose guys never thought I had a problem because they were doing exactly what I was doing and then when I have somebodynormal like my wife come in and she’s like that’s not normal you know and so II wish talk about stigmas I really wish that a lot of uh men and women in the in the law enforcement Community wouldwould stand up a little bit more and say hey dude like like your your Alaskan state trooper friend that that’s that’snot normal yeah help and and it’s okay it’s okay to to admit like okay I have aproblem or I’m doing it too much yeah yeah absolutely yeah dude same thing go to a normal cookout not a cop cookoutand like I’m four or five deep and I’m like everybody’s slow slow Drinkers and it was like know they’re like I remembertalking to one guy he’s like yeah I have like um Saturdays my wife and I will make like a nice Italian meal we’ll have like a glass or two of red wine I’m likewhy bother two glasses of red wine that that’s I never understood people they could only do a glass or two yeah justnever it’s just never been part of my my vocabulary yeah it’s fascinating man and and like there’s all like you saidthere’s all kinds of drinkers I had another friend who um was a binge Drinker he would like he sometimeswouldn’t drink all week and then but Saturday Sunday he’d be blacked out just black back out but he wouldn’t go downlike my thing was if I had too much to drink I wanted my bed I was like I don’t feel good I to put a foot on the floorso I don’t spin this guy you’d wake up like sharing a house with him you’d wake up at like 3: in the morning he’s still in the kitchen drinking vodka but hecan’t talk he’s awake but he’s just like he starts like a zombie and you’relike dude you you need to go to and you’re like I’m going to lock the bedroom to my bedroom door dude knowwhat the hell I know I know and and that’s probably his way of coping with what with whatever right because Ialways felt like I needed to top the next next best thing you know and and another thing that really bother me anda lot of guys that work in the profession have told me too is you get off that night shift you have to have aweight of decompressing right so maybe you don’t do alcohol maybe you do porn you know right sit three or four hoursin front of the computer and just waste my whole morning you know and I I I don’t mean to be preachy here but I’mjust saying it’s destructive it wasn’t good for my career it led me down dark paths that that you know here I am nowwhich I’m thankful for for where I am but um I’m in a position now where like man I lost so much time and I wastedsuch well I didn’t waste but I I just such a great career that I that I could have been better yeah yeah man andyou’re not being preachy brother because it’s true like you look at all these guys in the manosphere pushing their thing andthey’re like porn is evil porn is destroying young men it’s like or or alcohol it’s like yeah brother churchhas been saying that for 2,000 years yeah they they’ve told they’ve warned you you know it’s these are they justthey grab they grab on to some um some Christian value and it becomes like their the thing they rail against exceptthey’re not Believers it drives me nuts it’s like dude you’re you’re you’re getting there but what’s the roots of itlike who knew this before anybody else you know what I mean yeah yeah and if you’re if you’re this is a big componentwith the law enforcement Community is it is really hard for us to learn how to cope with things simply because we’reproblem solvers and we’ve always been able to go to a call um handle it deescalate it um wrap it up and move onright fix the problem or push it off on somebody else then you go home you havea problem you don’t know how to fix it because you can’t walk away from it right and and so I think a lot of menand women in the career struggle with this and so they just get into this deep downward spiral of of feeding intowhatever uh Vice or addiction it is that’s that’s keeping them from fromwinning yeah yeah absolutely there’s you see a lot of guys who they’re very talented very smart cops that can’t getaway from that can’t get away from lifestyle I’ve I mean I’ve heard people say long Tom coer say like I just need a couple to go to bed it’s like dude it’skind of rough I’m usually just tired you know but that’s uh that that’s that’sthat’s brutal man it’s hard to get away from it um Jeff can you tell us about one of your most intense or Terri teringcalls you dealt with uh this is another one where I havetwo really good examples um but I’ll stick with the one that’s close to to my Narrative of of drinking um so I grew sothe community I was in in my first agency um I probably should add so I started a smaller Agency New Mexico andthen I went to Phoenix to a larger agency oh yeah um yeah but that thatdoesn’t mean anything right now I just wanted to throw that in there but um but in that first agency I startedwith it’s an Air Force Community there’s a there’s a Air Force Base there um that’s primarily you know what’s in thecommunity it’s an officer’s base so there’s a lot of it’s a pilot’s base so there’s a lot of uh Air Force pilots andum so the base was probably I don’t know eight nine miles outside of thecommunity just outside of the city limits and so that evening that I was working Patrol um we had a rash of callsof large parties um and they were military parties um and I remember atGerman air force was station there at the same time so you as you can imagine there was a a lot of drinking there theylike beer yeah um and so you know we’re shagging all these calls and trying toyou know break them up and whatnot well it was closer to I don’t know 1 or two in the morning we get a Call of a carthat had rolled over just outside of the base gate and like I said it’s about 8 miles outside of the city um and justover the city limit so I was on that side of town um and I was like I’m going to go because the county usually hadlike two guys covering 6600 square miles it’s crazy wow um soI howel to this call I get there and literally it is just outside of the base gate there’s a car that had rolled umget to the car and inside of it are two drunk Airmen um both one is obviouslydead um he’s just spinal fluids coming out of the back of his neck and out ofhis ears um and the driver is slumped over on on on him um and there’s agonalbreathing going on so you know he’s he’s about to go out um I remember the smellof alcohol was strong um it’s funny how the Small Things stick into your mind umwhere I saw that he had his buddy’s base idea along with his that they had put inthe crack of the steering wheel like Hey we’re getting close to the base I’m going to put this right here so I could get it really quick and show thesecurity forces guy so those were still sticking in the steering wheel and I’m thinking man they almost made it rightof course the the security forces probably would have tagged him at the gate I wish that would have happened umbut what really stuck out to me is uh you know being the first officer there and EMS shows up I had to help extractuh the one that was still somewhat went breathing and uh I just remember theseguys were probably a year younger than me yeah you know and and um I had bloodall over my boots from the from the driver when we pulled him out um and it to me it was just sosurreal um because for the first time I had encountered death due to alcohol umwith individuals that were just like me my age you know I could I could relatesomewhat to it at the time I mean did it help with my further Journey no it didn’t but I just remember thatum if this could happen to them it could happen to me and then I’m like well wait a minute I’m a police officer I getpulled over they drive me home right not a big deal right but these guys I meanit it just it stuck in my mind for years and years that you know their parentssent them off to go be in the Air Force they get stationed at this base they go to a party and man like that both ofthem gone just gone and from one of these large parties that we were breaking up in the city at the timeright and so um I I I mean I I’ve dealt with a lot of um drunk individuals whohave expired um and you know it’s usually older people or you know a car accident with afamily but this for some reason just stuck with me and so yeah I would I would say out of all a lot of the theterrifying you know incidents I’ve responded to that’s the one that thatput me on my heels where I actually had to pull over wash the blood off my boots at the end and and just sit there andthink about it and I wish it I wish it would have had a more of an impact on methen like it does to now you know yeah yeah it is great I mean it is a perfectexample of like alcohol taking everything from a person CU it’s not like someone hit them he was the drunkone with his with so much um life ahead of him was he’s inthe air for you know what I mean he’s taking the right steps it could have been such a great life and you you seethe consequence right there it’s crazy yeah and and and I don’t you knowa lot of my stories you know War stories that I think about are always involved deathand you know one of the reasons I think that those stick out more than anything is because I sought out chaos I soughtout fights I sought out those late night you know uh rolling around on the groundtrying to get a suspect or foot chases that was normal that felt good to me uhthat’s what I thrived in so it wasn’t a big deal to me it was the death that sticks out more than anything else rightbecause I was like those fights that I’m in that’s what I signed up to do right um but when I signed up to be a cop Inever really put it together well I’m going to have to be cleaning up the mess of somebody else’s mistakes you knowwhen it comes to death and so that you you know when you ask like what thingsstand out in your career and I’m like golly man all I have to talk about is death and alcohol and of course that’smy mission now so maybe maybe that’s it but yeah it just it’s a very umsobering realization now yeah yeah I imagine um what what was the point Jeffwhere you were like when you realized this is a problem like at what when didthat happen was there an event that happened that like slapped you silly or was it just a slow recognition a severalseveral events um yeah I so I I got arrested so the look at the uh irony inthis I so once I got on federally I was working with Homeland Security I was stationed up in WashingtonDC I went uh back home to New Mexico because there’s a Homeland Securitytraining facility uh in Southern New Mexico near my home Community um and Iwas like I will absolutely go to that because it’s an hour from my home and I can go back home and see all my oldbuddies right um in that event I went and I got arrested for DUI by by thedepartment where I started and so and of course it’s it had been years and yearsso it’s all new officers it’s a whole bunch of guys who didn’t know me you know so there was no no help in thatwhich I’m glad there wasn’t because it had to happen um but you would think that that would be the real that thatwould be the point of of turning over it wasn’t I mean there would be numerous incidents after that um it wasn’t untilin the last uh you know three or four years of my career where um it got to the point where my family was detachedfrom me um my daughter’s starting to understand what’s going on um and I wason the verge of losing everything um I’d been to rehab twice um that’s anotherthat’s a that’s a fun thing to go through with an agency um you know bothboth times were with federal agencies and I think that the disconnect with understanding that uh a person that’sstruggling is a whole lot larger than it is on a smaller uh agency or a policeagency I think they stick together a little bit better um but it was in those last two or three orthree or four years of leaving um I started to realize I didn’t love my job anymore um I wasn’t do I wasn’t usefulto my job I wasn’t useful to myself and I certainly wasn’t useful to my family um there was some divine interventionthere with god um some things that just popped up um that I had never paidattention to so I started listening and that’s when I said to myself you know what it’s either mycareer um or getting sober and so I I picked I want to get sober um I wasgoing to lose my wife and and my daughter and they’re going to be with me all the way till the end yeah that youknow my career’s not everybody’s going to forget about me once you retire um I I also should add that I’ve had two necksurgeries during my career um I got I got a nice plate in my neck it hasnothing to do with anything other than the fact I was born that way so it was getting painful for me to do my job isgetting painful to hold rifles up for a long time was and and also I was if Iwere to get in a fight with a suspect and they were put me in the headlock I probably wouldn’t be able to defendmyself so that just helped me make the decision yeah to leave and so ithappened at the same time leaving my career and getting sober um two of thebest decisions for Jeff ever you know yeah absolutely sounds like a no brander you made the right choice absolutelyyeah and you got to do all the fun stuff early on and here we are talking you’re still here you know what I mean yeah andmy career like I said Divine I got to do nearly everything that I wanted to do asin a law enforcement career in uniform early on I went Federal thinking thatwas the Pinnacle of the law enforcement career which it’s not I learned quickly you know I should have stayed in uniformum but I I was like okay I got to put all those notches in my bell but now now I’m like for what for what you know Imean it’s I I one day I’ll tell my daughter stories and maybe she’ll appreciate them but to her you knowhaving a hero as a dad is more important than a hero than a dad who’s a hero at his job yeah well it’s good for thingspolice see so I appreciate it yeah but uh I mean that’s that’s the stingingirony of wisdom you don’t have it when you’re young you get it now and then you go ohdamn no yeah and yeah I mean I’m fortunate that I I am alive and I’m fortunate that I didn’t kill anybodyright yeah we’re not immune even in in our position or behind the badge that’sthat’s for sure and I think the the newer breed of officers that are going in um are not as equipped and this isjust my personal opinion not as equipped with dealing with the traumas of the job um and I pray that they are starting toeducate them more because if you go into the career with traumas existing already like I did like my story goes all theway back to Childhood trauma I wanted to be a a helper that’s why I went into law enforcement uh you know following my dadum and so I didn’t have coping mechanisms for that so what am I going to do when I start compounding it with awhole bunch of things like the Airman in the car or the baby that babies that I did CPR on you know stuff like SE my myfirst sergeant killed himself um you know I just I didn’t think it like you saidwhen you young you’re like this part of the job got to move on right but when you get in your 40s like me I’m like manI messed up yeah that’s why the Army recruits 18 year olds my man becausethey’re not thinking about it yeah charge it’s a bunch of 35y olds i”d belike wait a minute we could be killed here sense right this plan is there’ssomething off about this plan yeah let’s talk about this for four to six weeks umyeah man that’s uh incredible um thank thank the Lord You’re it was a path I mean that wasthat was your path that’s what was supposed to happen and here you are and you’re you’re here to share share yourjourney with people which is super important when when let me ask you thiswhen um when you became a Fed say say for home and security do you rememberany one thing that you got to do that you were like this is super cool federal agent stuff like this is stuff that likeis you know I’m sure it wasn’t all the time you’re like this is pretty cool oh yeah yeah I mean uh I know I talkedabout it in my book I I got in a Pursuit with another federal agent um we’re pursuing that federal agent for so I Iworked for a component with Homeland Security that did criminal basically in criminal Internal Affairs for all ofHomeland Security oh interesting um so homeland security has 27 components Secret Service Coast Guard border patrolyou know just right it’s a it’s a behemoth So within that there was 200agents that we would go a we’d have first right first right of refusal oncriminal misconduct cases of its employees um andso one of the many cases we’d have Living On the Border when I started inin Arizona was we have a lot of corruption with some of the Border agencies with um smuggling drugs and soI I got in a Pursuit with another FAL agent who was um a driving instructor hedri yeah I mean they talk about an hourong Pursuit um but I mean the thethe gravity the gravity of it all hit me you know he rolled his truck at the end but seeing you know his vest his gearyou know everything in his truck spread out all over the place um thinking thiswas another agent who had been entrusted who took an oath it’s gross huh to serice Country yeah and I would see thatover and over and you you asked me too like another reason I I I I kind of went into the wrong direction with my careergoing into that position because I would see so much gross misconduct betweenother agents and agencies that I started become cynical um you know it was no longer being useful to your community itwas like cleaning up the mess of what the government has done um you know I wehad cases with Secret Service agents you you know um misallocating resources in order toprotect their own you know taking away assets away from the White House you know stuff like that W um stuff that youwould never think happens but it does yeah and and then you work a year on aninvestigation much like some of those Secret Service cases I work on and the only thing that happens is one guy getsdemoted and the senior guy gets sent to another agency with the same pay and soI’m like this is this is a joke this is a joke man for for for me personally it for somebody who I think was more of aof a blue guy um I it just wasn’t the right fit anymore for me so that’s toughman that that I never thought about that doing Internal Affairs that is the the depressing part about it is like you’vealways held this job and uh the people you work with in a high standard and the Public High I mean the public holds usto a higher standard and they should because we have the right to take their Freedom or shoot them um to see themsomeone abuse that must be so disheartening it’s like you know and the irony the irony of it all is I wasinvestigating misconduct but yet I was practicing misconduct every night rightat home driving drunk or or going to conferences or whatever getting hammeredacting like Unbecoming of my position you know yep yeah hey man whatdo they say the uh the heart of man is wicked we got to battle it all yeah ohyeah oh yeah it it definitely can’t sit still too long yep absolutely wow I’mglad I asked that question that was fascinating um Jeff can you tell us about a heartwarming call that you wenton or a case that you had anything like that in your career this was a tough one um it usually is so yeah I mean I I loveI love when we get complimented uh for for for our service um but I there was agirl going she was a she was addicted to methamphetamine um you know had all thetelltale signs she always had the pop marks always looked fril always making poor decisions um and I alwaysfelt compelled to try to help her the best I could you know one of the things as an officer I was like nobody El a lawenforcement officer may be the only therapy these people are getting and Isay therapy Loosely right yeah very very poor poor quality therapy it’s not it’snot throwing them in handcuffs getting rid of him it’s like hey you got to get your act together hey it’s Gotta you know you can do better youknow more with your life and so there was this girl that I always felt compelled to to share a little bit ofyou know young naive wisdom I had at the time to tell her hey you can you know you can get through this so in thoseinteractions it must have sparked something with her because every time I would see her andit and if she was clean at that time you know she would always come up and say hey Jeff you know I’m I’m I’m clean Ihaven’t had anything in a month you know one day is a big deal you know I would tell her and so I remember seeing herwork at Walmart walked in there and I was like I’m so happy for you um youknow this is what it’s about trying to uh remediate not just you know on the CRI level or the Justice level but likehey this is a life um but the unfortunate side of all of this is thatyou know I remember seeing here uh when I was um at a restaurantwe’d always do breakfast uh my group the group of guys I work narcotics with andshe was working at that restaurant and I remember seeing her she waved at me she was really proud she wasa waitress and and I was like man look at her she looks really good well of course all the guys I’m I’m with youknow who were familiar with who she was were like look at her just you know mocking her making fun of her oh man andshe got upset and I remember seeing her oh she heard them she heard them you know oh dude and and I’m like how’s sheever going to get better if you Knuckleheads are are going to continue to put her down and so I remember running to the back of the therestaurant into the kitchen and and grabbing her and saying hey you know I’m proud of you you you you’re doing thebest you can and and you’re doing well and I believe in you and of course I didn’t go back and tell the guys I hadsaid that but it was just really uh disconcerting to me because I’m like where this is not what we’re about youknow yeah that’s heartbreaking to hear yeah damn well I’m glad you went and and let her know that’s like a scene from amovie you know someone over hears that and well and I I wonder to this day where she is and how’s she doing is shealive you know I pray that she she’s doing well and doing better because you know it’s nobody else has probably everpulled her to the to the side and and said hey I believe in you or I’m proud of you you know and that’s great manthat’s a beautiful story I’m glad you shared it people love the heartwarming stories I added that question years agobecause it was the show was so dark I’m like we need to have something but um death death yeah you guys really comethrough with these stories and it’s funny because it a lot of you guys don’t even realize like how great the story isyou know like ah this one’s kind of you know whatever but man that’s that’s a great story I love it man I’m I I praytoo that she is doing well and has stayed clean and sober and is not involved in nefarious activity at thispoint um Jeff real popular question here uh is advice to new officers I just gotuh I wish I had I’m such a knucklehead man it’s like I get these great emails and I’m like ah during the week I’m likeI should share that on the show and then I like totally I get like in a panic right before we record and I’m like I forget everything but um I got a reallygreat uh I didn’t ask him if I could share it but um a really great email couple days ago from a gentleman that hehad heard you guys tell your stories and like big part of the mission of the podcast is to like encourage people andto sh shine a good light on police work you know um and he has done other careers and has thought about it foreverand is now um you know gonna be a copper you know like I I’ve gotten yeah so manyof these emails I get pictures from Academy graduations likees because I listen to your show and the guys youspeak with and in women um you know it really inspired me to actually do a ridealong look into it and um and check it out so all that to say the question is um advice for people who are thinkingabout being police officers or maybe somebody who’s in backgrounds or is just got ofAcademy um I I think the biggest thing that I wish I would have known is it’sokay to show humility um in my career um it’s okay you it’s okay to fail um it’sokay not to know what you’re doing um you know it’s a great Community to lean on each other with um but I also thinkthat you got to have the mindset that not everybody’s doingthe career because for the right reasons um so you need to worry about yourselfum and your mental um Health um and your family I wish I would have put my familyfor first uh during my career and my mental health first because in the end it just shows that hey you know I was nogood to the profession anymore because I never paid attention to myself and so part of that is just showing humility umyou know if you have a problem or if you have a concern really leaning on other people um within your law enforcementcommunity and if you can’t find it don’t be afraid to find it somewhere else you’re not above anybody else rightwe’re all in this together we’re all brothers and sisters um and just to know that it’s going tobe all right it’s not the end of the world and it’s okay to be weak and Iwish I had talked more about faith during my career with with some of my partners because when I left my careerand I wrote this book and I pushed it out and I sent it to everybody that I had worked with previously I could notbelieve how many guys wrote back and said I never knew you were a brother in Christ I never knew that you were youknow you were Christian or and I was like I worked with you you know 15 yearsago and I never knew that you were a follower you know and I wish I would have known because it could have made aworld of difference I mean my behavior may have not changed or maybe it would have I don’t know maybe we would haveyou know uh realized that hey we’re we’re F you know fallible people um andthat we need to be um better at being umbetter people in our career and I have backup my buddy right here agrees with me I’m not trying to follow the crowd oflike you said drinking with all my buddies because that’s what I want to do and that’s what’s um part of the cultureso I just in short pay attention to yourself and know and know who you’reworking with excellent yeah great advice um Jee let’s talk about the book manso very successful long career bit of a roller coaster I’m sure the book isfilled with I mean I can tell just we’re scratching the surface here of um your successes and your you know fumbles andhow you kind of came out of it um what but what made you want to like actually write a book aboutit well like I said I I for the longest time I wasn’t useful uh to myself or myfamily and so I felt compelled that I needed to be useful to somebody you know somebody else now um you know I I’ve perpraed over this addiction uh a day at a time right it’s it’s not like I won I’mstill fighting battles but um I really wanted to push that out there that there is hope to people that are you know inlaw enforcement or you don’t have to be in law enforcement it could be any career right that’s just what I knew anduh you’re not unique if in your struggles you’re not uh there’s so many of us that that struggle um some wenever know about until it’s too late um so I felt that if I wrote my storybecause we learn from uh hearing other people’s story right that’s that’s the way it works and um us as humans we’remeant to help other people um and I feel like if I shared my story somebodysomebody anybody you know will get some type of um idea or resolution from it umand then pay it forward because that’s what we’re supposed to do absolutely I love it man it’s great I love the covertoo I just noticed it when you were talking it’s a federal Shield just kind of resting in like a glass with rocks init like obviously some kind of brown liquor I don’t know what your poison your pick your poison of choice was mypoison was vodka but it wouldn’t have shown up as good in that picture yeah like why is there a cup of ice yeah thatlooks like bourbon or something um it’s very cool man uh I love your story uh itwas real honor to have you on the show people can get your book um you just give me the link or tell me the link youwant me to use and I will put it in the show notes they can be easy they can just click on it and check it out they can follow you uh Instagram I’m guessingat sober from sin yeah Instagram threads uh X or Twitter whatever they call itnow it’s all the same handle at sober from send and I’m real big on LinkedIn too I’m trying to hit the workforce soyou can find me on there too I show the same information on there that’s smart yeah I was I was actually been told thatthat I should be doing more in LinkedIn but then I’m still active so it’s likeyeah the agency I’m with now is great Chief is great like likes the podcast supports it on patreon um but there areplaces that they think it’s ridiculous and they hate the idea of a cop having a podcast you know what I mean like wellyou know what I I think it’s great what you’re doing and and I love that you’re still on you have support with youragency because that’s the way it’s supposed to be right absolutely 100% so yeah I commend you man I I really dothanks brother I appreciate hey man through the podcast I’m able to have people like you on and get your message out there which is a good and righteousone so happy to do it like I said jefff it was an honor to have you on the show um link will be in the show notes followJeff on Instagram threads LinkedIn I’m going to do the show outro I got to thank the patreon sergeants can you hangon for just like two or three minutes yeah all right the great Jeff Fields guys uhreally fun and fascinating interview so so happy that he um was willing to come on this is the time in the show like Ispoke up at the top there that we thank the uh patreon sergeants and also I willsay there also a cap patreon captain now so I’ve made two other levels there’spatrolman Sergeant that’s that’s the way it had always been and then people were saying like well how not why not morelevels what if we want to give more generously or we have extra money and I said all right so I made a lieutenant level for 25 bucks I made a captainlevel for $100 just in case somebody wanted to do that and somebody did sowho I’m talking about is a great Captain Jamon Jack AdamMcMahon Adam mihal the great Andy bigs ladies and gentlemen Ben Peters BentleyBarnett the great Brad Thompson Dan Carlson at Bley Boors check him out everybody Chris June Clark Lov the greatDave Elman Dennis keriso ladies and gentlemen Doug and Kelly Newman love you guys see at church Elliot Sykeseverybody the great Gary Steiner George kottis thank you sir the Great big Gadboy ja family keep on keeping on thank you Jake Pineo James Rose the greatJason labre everybody Jason laau Jessica King John 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appreciation for what it is they actually do I love youguys and I will see you next time